Aim Punch Discussion (Split from Game Update Notes)

TheTotsTheTots Posts: 2,279Player
This discussion was created from comments split from: Game Update Notes (30 June 2016).
The game wasn't made exactly to my specifications, so I feel it's broken.

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Comments

  • SSKnecaboSSKnecabo Posts: 2,721Player
    Whiplash27 wrote: »

    [...] adding things like aim punch on top of suppression which are meant to reduce the already small skill curve in this game is crappy. It negates a lot of that great work because it makes the gameplay quality poor..

    This is something noone ever asked for and we never got any explanation on, we just got it and have to deal with it. I'd expect a brief explanation for such drastic changes in the patch notes but even after asking for it several time there hasn't been anything. I don't know how many devs are actively playing the game but it's undeniable how it worsened gameplay.
  • Bashar_al-AssadBashar_al-Assad Posts: 579Player
    edited July 2016
    SSKnecabo wrote: »
    Whiplash27 wrote: »

    [...] adding things like aim punch on top of suppression which are meant to reduce the already small skill curve in this game is crappy. It negates a lot of that great work because it makes the gameplay quality poor..

    This is something noone ever asked for and we never got any explanation on, we just got it and have to deal with it. I'd expect a brief explanation for such drastic changes in the patch notes but even after asking for it several time there hasn't been anything. I don't know how many devs are actively playing the game but it's undeniable how it worsened gameplay.

    The devs talked about that in their podcast long ago on why aim punch was required. They are on official youtube channel I think.
  • [Prt_Dictator][Prt_Dictator] Posts: 275Player
    SSKnecabo wrote: »

    This is something noone ever asked for and we never got any explanation on, we just got it and have to deal with it. I'd expect a brief explanation for such drastic changes in the patch notes but even after asking for it several time there hasn't been anything. I don't know how many devs are actively playing the game but it's undeniable how it worsened gameplay.
    This is 100% true.
    Of all the changes this game had, aimpunch was the one that put me over the edge and I still don't understand why it was needed in the first place.
    I absolutely hate how firefights work right now, there is almost never a clean fight, when people start spraying its just complete nonsense of randomness and mouse movement all over the place.
  • iNv|revert-iNv|revert- Posts: 96Player
    Pvt.Phushi wrote: »

    The devs talked about that in their podcast long ago on why aim punch was required. They are on official youtube channel I think.

    what was the reason it was "required" ?

  • SSKnecaboSSKnecabo Posts: 2,721Player
    Sorry but not gonna go through countless podcasts for a simple answer like that. I'm not here to go full rage mode, I just want to know the initial reason and if they are happy with how it turned out gameplay-wise or if they even realised how bad firefights play out atm.
  • Bashar_al-AssadBashar_al-Assad Posts: 579Player
    SSKnecabo wrote: »
    Sorry but not gonna go through countless podcasts for a simple answer like that. I'm not here to go full rage mode, I just want to know the initial reason and if they are happy with how it turned out gameplay-wise or if they even realised how bad firefights play out atm.

    Something along the lines of "you get shot and you behave like nothing happened and start shooting the opponent ". IIRC, it is to create an "atmosphere" of getting shot.
    Some people are complaining AAPG is not realistic, how you can run infinitely, how the cone should be more realistic. Others are saying less random, less realism etc. Whatever devs do someone complains.
  • iNv|revert-iNv|revert- Posts: 96Player
    TheTots wrote: »
    TheTots wrote: »

    Part of the issue is that it was so quick it could create situations where you could peek, shoot, kill, and go back in cover before the server could even update that your head was out at all to the other player.
    Dev kartigan did some clever math and made it so you can't do completely invisible lean kills any more.

    It'll take a little getting used to the speed difference, but it'll make for overall better gameplay we believe.

    I'll re post this since everyone keeps asking why it was done. It was bugged and regularly exploited, this closes the exploit. Simple as that.
    You can't counter something you can't even see.

    I was asking about why the aim punch was required.. I already read the issue with quick lean, an issue i've never once encountered personally.. which is odd because quick lean was a huge role in comp.. and yet I never encountered the issue that apparently was occurring.. I think all of the comp scene is behind me on that
  • [Prt_Dictator][Prt_Dictator] Posts: 275Player
    I was asking about why the aim punch was required..
    Thankfully these podcasts have a description so it was easy to find, it starts @ 2:19:

    It doesn't have a gameplay reason its basically because realism. When something terrible is added, chances are its because of "realism".
  • SSKnecaboSSKnecabo Posts: 2,721Player
    Pvt.Phushi wrote: »
    SSKnecabo wrote: »
    Sorry but not gonna go through countless podcasts for a simple answer like that. I'm not here to go full rage mode, I just want to know the initial reason and if they are happy with how it turned out gameplay-wise or if they even realised how bad firefights play out atm.

    Something along the lines of "you get shot and you behave like nothing happened and start shooting the opponent ". IIRC, it is to create an "atmosphere" of getting shot.
    Some people are complaining AAPG is not realistic, how you can run infinitely, how the cone should be more realistic. Others are saying less random, less realism etc. Whatever devs do someone complains.

    I understand people want realism but it should never come at the cost of gameplay. The game literally forces a playstyle on you, unless you are fighting long range you are now forced to spray as well resulting in two idiots hoping (since there is random recoil) to kill their oponent. I really wonder if they even noticed how firefights go or if they just don't care at this point.
  • 4DChessGenius4DChessGenius Posts: 2,156Player
    I think if you want to keep aim punch, you get rid of suppression. Can't have both.
    You joined the world's greatest army to become a graphic artist? Outstanding!
  • [Prt_Dictator][Prt_Dictator] Posts: 275Player
    Aimpunch is worse imo because it actually moves my crosshair in ways that I can't control (you never know when or if someone is going to hit you). You already chase the crosshair most of the time instead of controlling it because of the horizontal RNG in the recoil, the unpredictability of the aimpunch takes it to another level.

    Suppression is an annoyance that doesn't really have a purpose and could definitely get nerfed, especially from flashes and nades through walls.

    They're both poison, but I personally get more annoyed with aimpunch.
  • SSKnecaboSSKnecabo Posts: 2,721Player
    Whiplash27 wrote: »
    I think if you want to keep aim punch, you get rid of suppression. Can't have both.

    Yeah, having both rewards way too much for just shooting as fast as you can over actually aiming. You just point in the general direction and re-adjust while spraying.

    I believe removing aim punch would be better for your average casual gamer since it's not so much about aiming as it is with aim punch. Suppression has a smaller effect but it's still a good deal and definitely makes it harder for an opponent to aim his shots while suppressed.

    Removing suppression would result in rewarding quick precise aim instead of rewarding quick shooting into the general direction of an opponent so it's harder to use it effectively. The better aimer will get rewarded more often because it's now about aiming before shooting and not just spraying and hoping for the best. The reward is also severer as it - opposed to suppression - messes with the crosshair.

    Not gonna talk about this anymore, I've tried my best to explain it many times and it's tiring to not get any thoughts on this from the dev teams. Y'all have fun with those dull firefights.
  • RedBaron64(ITA)RedBaron64(ITA) Posts: 173Player
    It seems that someone would prefer a 'laser gun' game.....now we have a game with really '.a little piece' of realism .... but i want to be really evil and adding also the 'slow leaning' moanings i suspect that any feature that breaks 'mouse macros' don't like to..... >:)
  • SSKnecaboSSKnecabo Posts: 2,721Player
    edited July 2016
    It seems that someone would prefer a 'laser gun' game.....now we have a game with really '.a little piece' of realism .... but i want to be really evil and adding also the 'slow leaning' moanings i suspect that any feature that breaks 'mouse macros' don't like to..... >:)

    If you can't argue with facts and have to start accusing you better not comment at all. Laser guns by removing aim punch/suppression? Also interested on what kind of macros it would break, never used any so maybe I'm just not creative enough to think of anything that actually would make sense.
  • 4DChessGenius4DChessGenius Posts: 2,156Player
    edited July 2016
    It seems that someone would prefer a 'laser gun' game.....now we have a game with really '.a little piece' of realism .... but i want to be really evil and adding also the 'slow leaning' moanings i suspect that any feature that breaks 'mouse macros' don't like to..... >:)

    I don't understand posts like this. Most of the people posting in this thread have super high frag rates (mine is not so great in comparison). These guys have been top notch players before aim punch was put into place. They were top notch players before all of the gun or lean changes... and guess what? They're still top notch players who are capable of destroying any of us without trying all too hard. So, what's the point of a post like this? If you're going to argue for a feature then make good arguments rather than slinging insults and saying that these players aren't good enough.
    You joined the world's greatest army to become a graphic artist? Outstanding!
  • [ENG]Uni-Sol[ENG]Uni-Sol Posts: 3,193Player
    We tried laser guns, it was ridiculous, people could pull off across the map headshots. You can argue that it happens with a cone (and it does) but your chances of pulling it off by point and click are a massively reduced.
    If my trollery drives you crazy, you'd better put on your seatbelt.






  • {4F}DeadlyGrouse{4F}DeadlyGrouse Posts: 277Player
    nobody said anything about laser guns????? Game play was much better before aimpunch. Suppression was fine. Best thing to do if they want to keep aimpunch is limit it to upper torso only. that will be less rewarding for bad shots.
  • JungleSheepJungleSheep Posts: 87Player
    Does aim punch kick in when any part of the body is hit? What if it is limited to chest hits only? Also suppression needs to be reduced. I find it really hard to use any other gun against a M4 or M249 at close to medium range. ROF and suppression rules in a fire fight.

  • [Prt_Dictator][Prt_Dictator] Posts: 275Player
    I believe its the same anywhere on the body.
    This is one of those things that we can be sure because we played the game with it and without. Without aimpunch was better by a significant margin so I don't even think it should be reworked, just cut it out like the cancer it is.
  • =IK=Doba==IK=Doba= Posts: 2,789Player
    lel realism arguments win !!

    +1 remove aim punch
    +2 reduce suppression

    I want to compete for my kills not have a useless opponent cause hes either blurred out or his gun is pointed at the ground.. so much for the better shot wins.

    we need to up the skill level in this game.. you're drowning it
    _____________________________
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