AA5 Discussion Thread (Renamed)

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  • OICURMT!OICURMT! Posts: 117Beta Tester
    edited November 2018
    The numbers are not misleading or fake. They are fact in the Guinness do not go willy-nilly giving out awards.

    That said, your statements are correct. What I was pointing out was your generalization.

    Agreed that the franchise is struggling on the PC, PS/4 will probably follow the same trend.

    All recommendation in this thread should be taken seriously if the franchise wants to "breakout" into the mainstream. Specificity on how success is defined is important (think KPI's). For the US Army, their idea of success may be completely different to what we here think it is. They may think that it's already successful, just getting old (it was played more in open beta than today).

    OIC!
    --

    In life, there is no respawn... why should there be in a game?
  • vapor.ivapor.i Posts: 269Player
    Netscape and Yahoo had "search engines" in the bag and that was the default go to for searching.....enter Google. They redefined a search engine well after the search engine was a thing to make something simple yet highly effective.
    Endpoint...just because they have 1 million games...just make something that works and a community can back and you got a winner like aa2 :awesome:
    AA2 veteran player / fanboy
  • 4DChessGenius4DChessGenius Posts: 2,121Player
    OICURMT! wrote: »
    The numbers are not misleading or fake. They are fact in the Guinness do not go willy-nilly giving out awards.

    As a note, I'd think that any of those non-military related records have since been surpassed. We know that TF2 for example has over 50M downloads. Fortnite recently had 80M players in a month. That certainly surpassed any numbers AA2 had. AA2 was certainly a huge success by any metric. Let's hope AA5 can regain some of the past glory that the original had.
    You joined the world's greatest army to become a graphic artist? Outstanding!
  • .!.dgodfather.!.dgodfather Posts: 445Player
    *Crosses Fingers* for excellent AA5
    Fragweiser Website
    Make AA Great Again!
  • doogle!doogle! Posts: 678Player
    OICURMT! wrote: »
    The numbers are not misleading or fake. They are fact in the Guinness do not go willy-nilly giving out awards.

    That said, your statements are correct. What I was pointing out was your generalization.

    Agreed that the franchise is struggling on the PC, PS/4 will probably follow the same trend.

    All recommendation in this thread should be taken seriously if the franchise wants to "breakout" into the mainstream. Specificity on how success is defined is important (think KPI's). For the US Army, their idea of success may be completely different to what we here think it is. They may think that it's already successful, just getting old (it was played more in open beta than today).

    OIC!

    Not arguing with ya, just adding on.

    Yes, they do hand out stupid awards.
    https://list25.com/25-strangest-guinness-world-records/

    The numbers may not be fake, but they certainly are misleading. I can tell you with 99% certainty that those numbers have been used in US military or US civil service performance reports. I'd also bet they have been used as proof that the AA series is successful, and should be continued.
  • 4DChessGenius4DChessGenius Posts: 2,121Player
    doogle! wrote: »
    Not arguing with ya, just adding on.

    Yes, they do hand out stupid awards.
    https://list25.com/25-strangest-guinness-world-records/

    The numbers may not be fake, but they certainly are misleading. I can tell you with 99% certainty that those numbers have been used in US military or US civil service performance reports. I'd also bet they have been used as proof that the AA series is successful, and should be continued.

    Not much different than saying AAPG for PC has been downloaded 2 million times! Seems pretty great, until you realize how many people actually stuck around.
    You joined the world's greatest army to become a graphic artist? Outstanding!
  • 4DChessGenius4DChessGenius Posts: 2,121Player
    edited November 2018
    BTW, back on AA5. IMO, in terms of features (let's get of the topic of gameplay for a bit) I think you need to have a few things at the minimum on Day 1 in order to get people to want to stick around.

    1) Maps - Some of the most popular AA2 maps. Pipeline, Weapons Cache, Insurgent Camp, Hospital (original version), pick a few others. Throw in Inner Hospital if you want and maybe a couple other maps from AA3/AAPG, if you feel like it. You can then include a few original maps as well.
    2) Weapons - You can include the same weapons that are in AAPG right now. However, more attachments! Front attachments especially. If you have less attachments than AA2 on your weapons then there's a problem. Suppressor, bipod, grenade launcher, shotgun, foregrip, I'm sure there are others. More customization = better
    3) Squads/Fire teams - Self explanatory
    4) Training - At the minimum basic training with more to come. You can even use your cartoons or real videos of what that training may look like in real life as little cut scenes (didn't AA3 do something like this?)

    Optional: Medical system - Honestly, I wouldn't be heartbroken if there was no real medic system at launch (meaning no bleeding or revive system). If the medical system is lame then leave it out until you can figure out a thoughtful way of doing it. The original America's Army didn't have a medical component until much later. It's not a requirement up front IMO. Also, the medical system must at the minimum have an active component, players should be able to heal each other while they're still alive not only when guys are knocked out. If your idea is AAPG's medical system plus an active component (sort of like AA3 without the questions to be answered) then fine, just get rid of the gauze and make it look more realistic or even have it so that there's no animation. No animation > gauze on everything. Also, please no self bandaging, it makes your gameplay look awful when guys are constantly bandaging themselves during and after every fight.
    You joined the world's greatest army to become a graphic artist? Outstanding!
  • vapor.ivapor.i Posts: 269Player
    Revives imo should not be in the game period. With 2,000 tracked hours of aa2 and probably another 1,000 before aaotracker was born....you learned very quick on how to be an asset to your team or be dead in spectate mode lol. It gave you incentive to play as a team & be cautious and thorough while attacking or defending. Sure you could gamble on being a rambo but 9 times out of 10 it didn't pay off too often.
    Also just opening all weapon classes is just more silver platter handouts to players that can't hack qualifying with a weapon via training. I can still remember doing E&E sf training, it forced you to be patient and methodical. I know this would create a more in depth & lengthy training section but it's worth it's weight in gold.
    AA2 veteran player / fanboy
  • doogle!doogle! Posts: 678Player
    +1 more weapons / attachments / classes IF
    --kits are limited to squad roles, and maps (yes, like AA2)

    I actually enjoyed the medic system in AA2. Rambos existed, but getting too far away from the squad medic could prove deadly as you either bled out, or become "Red" and your movement is so painfully slow that you die when farted on.

    +1 on training.
    -Lengthy BMT training to make creating a new account a bit more painful.
    -Medic training, CPR, self-aid buddy care
    -CBRNE
    -Marksmanship training

    Maybe even think about radical [TOS Violation] like...play around with PRT training as a way to "unlock/progress/level" up speed (obviously capped.) Meaning, you're only moving at full capacity (or sprint distances) based on how far you've progressed in your virtual PRT program.

    The Army could even incorporate PME into the game. Want to rank up to the NCO ranks, thus unlocking the ability to fulfil certain squad roles? Cool, you gotta do this block of training.

    idk

  • aaHollywoodaaHollywood Posts: 372Developer
    Whiplash27 wrote: »
    Our definitions of huge success must differ. Based on the recent numbers we've seen on PS4, they wouldn't even sniff the top 100 games on Steam. Is the PS4 version more popular? Sure. Maybe the Army considers that successful, so be it. However, I consider a game that can average a concurrent 20K+ players successful, not less than 2K. A well made AA game can easily achieve those numbers. I think that even shooting for PS4 type numbers is a loser mentality. This game has a pretty big base waiting for a return to form and will come back. That in itself gives you a good starting point for where it can go.

    Yeah our definitions of success do differ -- those Army videos you watch during loading? They are viewed 150k-200k times a month. To the man in charge, yes that is a huge success.

    As a dev do we want more players? Yes absolutely, but eyeballs are what keep the lights on. /js
  • 4DChessGenius4DChessGenius Posts: 2,121Player
    edited November 2018
    Whiplash27 wrote: »
    Our definitions of huge success must differ. Based on the recent numbers we've seen on PS4, they wouldn't even sniff the top 100 games on Steam. Is the PS4 version more popular? Sure. Maybe the Army considers that successful, so be it. However, I consider a game that can average a concurrent 20K+ players successful, not less than 2K. A well made AA game can easily achieve those numbers. I think that even shooting for PS4 type numbers is a loser mentality. This game has a pretty big base waiting for a return to form and will come back. That in itself gives you a good starting point for where it can go.

    Yeah our definitions of success do differ -- those Army videos you watch during loading? They are viewed 150k-200k times a month. To the man in charge, yes that is a huge success.

    As a dev do we want more players? Yes absolutely, but eyeballs are what keep the lights on. /js

    150-200K per month isn't a ton if it's the same 10K people watching them over and over. I'm sure your average Army commercial on TV gets watched by millions in a single airing. I mean I personally don't understand why everyone is getting so defensive at saying that AAPG is extremely underplayed in comparison to comparable games in the market. I've laid out games that have been downloaded as much as this one and average more players. If you compare downloads vs. average players and there's such a huge skew compared to the competition, it should be a signal that something is wrong. We want AA5 to be a success and pointing out that AAPG is deficient in various areas needs to be accepted if the next version is going to be improved.

    The next game needs to be built in a way to show the Army as a well trained elite fighting unit. That means a game built on competition that calls back to the best parts of the series. Your competitive game is the closest way to showcase how a real Army unit would operate because pub games rarely/never do.
    I know lots of people come in here talking about simulators or uber tactical games. That is such a niche crowd. Sure, Arma, Squad, and Insurgency do decently well all things considered and this game would probably kill to have Arma's numbers at this point, but those games fill such a small niche that they'll never be as big as any of the other big hitters in the market or even how big AA2 was.
    You joined the world's greatest army to become a graphic artist? Outstanding!
  • doogle!doogle! Posts: 678Player
    I wonder if you could track the stats of how many people have "In-Game Music" disabled...thus muting the videos.
  • -pR|Arkeiro-pR|Arkeiro Posts: 751Player
    doogle! wrote: »
    I wonder if you could track the stats of how many people have "In-Game Music" disabled...thus muting the videos.

    I know one who does.

    Over 1.3k Golden Hawkeyes.
  • aaHollywoodaaHollywood Posts: 372Developer
    doogle! wrote: »
    I wonder if you could track the stats of how many people have "In-Game Music" disabled...thus muting the videos.

    We track that. No one does.
  • doogle!doogle! Posts: 678Player
    doogle! wrote: »
    I wonder if you could track the stats of how many people have "In-Game Music" disabled...thus muting the videos.

    We track that. No one does.

    :p
  • Foutre?!Foutre?! Posts: 713Player
    doogle! wrote: »
    I wonder if you could track the stats of how many people have "In-Game Music" disabled...thus muting the videos.

    We track that. No one does.

    Yet I always had it muted until I found a way to completely remove the video's from the loading screens. :glasses:
  • -piSSko;-piSSko; Posts: 15Player
    doogle! wrote: »
    I wonder if you could track the stats of how many people have "In-Game Music" disabled...thus muting the videos.

    We track that. No one does.

    Yet I always had it muted until I found a way to completely remove the video's from the loading screens. :glasses:

  • Keebler750Keebler750 Posts: 3,605Beta Tester
    Plays Army video game, complains it's done all wrong, and refuses to watch the content the Army made the game for in the first place. Says he just wants to make it better.

    Okay then.
    ______

    This has been a test of the emergency flame-fest system. Please do not adjust your set.
  • MaclobsterMaclobster Posts: 214Beta Tester
    edited November 2018
    :+1:
    (\/) (',,') (\/)
    Pipeline
    HonorTown
  • 4DChessGenius4DChessGenius Posts: 2,121Player
    I think the videos are pretty decent. Some are more interesting than others, however, after you've watched them a few times...
    You joined the world's greatest army to become a graphic artist? Outstanding!
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